Brother Hill:
It gives me some assurance to see our new IBEW IP taking part in open forums. You appear to be a down to earth Brother. I'm hoping this is true and that you will respond to my post. Until this year there were only two locals in Ontario Canada that allowed contractors to select JWs from the unemployed list. The contractors then successfully lobbied the Ontario Government for changes to the Labor Relations Act and we now have selective hiring throughout Ontario. Under these selective hiring agreements there is unchecked discrimination and/or brothers and sisters are being by-passed on the list because another member was selected for a completely arbitrary reason. The detrimental effects of this on our Union and our Brotherhood are too numerous to mention. Besides tipping the scales in favor of the contractors, it's against our constitution. In 1999, I asked Brother Barry to clarify IO's position on selective hiring. I subsequently received a disappointing phone call from District 1 IVP, Don Lounds, who refused to put his response in writing. Understanding that I'm having trouble comprehending how IO can condone or remain unconcerned over selective hiring, could you state your position on this issue. Fraternally Tim Mitchinson LU303
I don't know exactly what you are talking about, however I will inquire about the issue. Ed Hill
Brother Hill: Thank you for responding so quickly, I'm impressed. I can briefly explain what has happened to the IBEW in Ontario. We have 13 locals throughout Ontario. Until May, 1998, Local 804 was the only Local that had an agreement with the contractors that allowed contractors to select JWs from their unemployed list. Based on the results of a survey done in the later part of 1996, Local 303 implimented a selective hiring agreement effective May, 1998, where local contractors can select 50% of their workforce and the remaining 50% went by the list on a first in, first out basis. With 130 unemployed and certain members being consistently selected again and again, the available work has not been distributed fairly and many brothers and sisters have run out of employment insurance without sufficient hours to renew another claim. Then late last year the Ontario Government amended the Labor Act with Bill 69. This Bill was a direct frontal assault on all construction trade unions in Ontario. It affects wage rates, apprentice ratios, room and board allowances etc but moreover, it allows contractors to select up to 75% of their required manpower per project. Of the total workforce required, 40% can be mobile employees (travellers) and 35% of the total workforce can be selected from the home local. The majority of Ontario's IBEW Locals signed a Memorandum of Agreement to supposedly save themselves from the impositions of Bill 69 and by doing so alienated themselves from many other construction trades that were standing in solidarity against Bill 69. In my opinion since the Memorandum of Agreement still allows 50% selection (it varies up and down), it is worse than Bill 69 because it applies this percentage to the jurisdiction and not the project. The potential for abuse is enormous. We have lost 40 years of negotiations in one foul swoop. Fraternally Tim Mitchinson
First, I firmly believe in the autonomy of each Local Union to operate as it feels best for its members, within the constraints of the IBEW Constitution and the official rules and procedures of the brotherhood. Secondly, whether I condone or agree with the practice is not even a question that I have a right to answer, it would seem that the Local Union leaders did what they had to do and for that I applaud them. I am not sure what I would have done in their place but they did what they had to do. It is easy to second guess them and I will not do engage in that practice, it is difficult enough to be a local union leader without me or anyone else second guessing them. Ed Hill
Brother Hill
Firstly, my thanks for your prompt investigation on this issue. After admitting, "I don't know exactly what you are talking about" you have taken time to fully familiarize yourself with the particulars on this issue and have now responded to my query, or have you? I must admit that your initial lack of awareness to this issue causes me concern. If the International Office doesn't become involved in issues of this magnitude, when do you get involved? Possibly you were relying on the First District IVP. If you were, I can understand this lack of awareness.
Secondly, you state, "I firmly believe in the autonomy of each Local Union to operate as it feels best for its members, within the constraints of the IBEW Constitution and the official rules and procedures of the brotherhood." Last I heard the IBEW had only one Constitution. The copy that I have states, "Declaration of the IBEW - Our cause is the cause of human justice, human rights, human security. We refuse, and will always refuse, to condone or tolerate dictatorship or oppression of any kind." My copy also says one of the IBEW's Objects is, "To seek security for the individual." Please advise if you have a more recent edition of the Constitution that states, "We will turn our heads when brothers or sisters are being discriminated against or oppressed through selective hiring " or "To seek security for only those individuals approved by the contractors".
Thirdly, you state, "whether I condone or agree with the practice is not even a question that I have a right to answer, it would seem that the Local Union leaders did what they had to do and for that I applaud them." Well, there's internal politics blocking the road to Democracy and Brotherhood again. You further state, "I am not sure what I would have done in their place but they did what they had to do". Why are you not sure what you would have done? As far as "doing what they had to do", they (our leaders) claim the government held a gun to their heads and forced them to sign or face the consequence. That consequence was the revoking of Section 1(4) of the Labour Act. It didn't require a high priced lawyer, for which we have many, to determine the gun had already gone off. As I explained before, the government amended Sec. 1(4) and effectively achieved the same results as if they had revoked it. So please explain why our leaders had to do what they did. Can you still applaud them knowing they gave 40 years of negotiations away for nothing?
Lastly, you state, "It is easy to second guess them and I will not engage in that practice, it is difficult enough to be a local union leader without me or anyone else second guessing them." When things are done right the first time there is no need to second guess anyone. Am I correct in understanding that under the official IBEW rules this Memorandum of Agreement for which three of thirteen BAs adamantly opposed, required and received IP approval?
For Brotherhood Tim Mitchinson
P.S. Is "The Union of Hearts and Minds" a motto or just another slogan?
Date: Fri May 18, 2001 7:51 pm Subject: IBEW becoming another Labor Ready? Say it ain't so!!
I found this following article at another site... If this is true it is incredibly detrimental to the future of the Brotherhood as we know it!! ------
WARNING for all IBEW Members!
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The International Office for the International Brotherhood of Electrical Workers has been made aware of an agreement between IBEW Local 303 (Niagara Region)and the Niagara Peninsula Electrical Contractor's Association which allows contractors to arbitrarily select members from Local 303's unemployed list. This agreement does not ensure the practical and fair distribution of available work to qualified members. In addition, it is an agreement which totally favours the Contractors and does nothing to advance the interests of the IBEW. In a letter dated March 4, 1999, I requested clarification of Article XV, Sec. 6, of the IBEW Constitution and intervention by the International President. In response, I had expected the International President to rescind the agreement, given it's anti union tendencies, but instead I received a telephone call from the First District International Vice President informing me there will be no response. This agreement is currently in effect without having secured the International President's approval. Brothers and Sisters, if this agreement is allowed to remain in effect it will likely spread to other locals, perhaps even yours.
From: "Tim Mitchinson" <tmitchinson@s...> Date: Sun May 20, 2001 5:49 am Subject: IBEW becoming another Labor Ready? Say it ain't so!!
Hello Brothers and Sisters! First, I'd like to thank ----- for connecting me with this site; ----- for a speedy approval and ----- for posting the article, "WARNING for all IBEW Members!" of which I am the author. It has apparently struck a nerve with many and rightly so. This is not a subject to be taken lightly as I will explain.
According to the Constitution, IO approval is required on all agreements. It does not state any exceptions. If IO wished to render an agreement invalid, this is the hammer they would use. I have asked for IO to confirm this and to also confirm their position on the "selective hiring agreements" but they refuse to respond appropriately. As stated in my article, I received a phone call from the District IVP, but he refused to put anything in writing (no surprise there). As recently as last week at a different site( www.ibewtravelers.net / open forum ), I popped this question to Brother Ed Hill . As Brother Hill is the first IP willing to discuss members concerns openly on the net, I perceived him as possibly travelling his own road. Unfortunately, his evasive response now leads me to believe he's continuing to travel down Barry Ave.
This agreement was originally introduced to LU 303 based on the results of a 1996 survey conducted by mail. The survey was sent to all IBEW LU members in Ontario, Canada. Although 50/50 selective hiring was overwhelmingly turned down provincially, it was determined that out of LU 303s approx. 400 members, 78 members had responded, and of these, 48 members were in favour of selective hiring. There's your majority vote. The membership had no notion of the intent when in 1998 our BA signed a 50/50 agreement. Documents indicate that 11 of the responding members to the survey were not even working in the trade. That's democracy! This was only the beginning.
In December 2000, the Provincial Government amended the Labour Relations Act with Bill 69. Under this Bill, contractors can select up to 75% of their required manpower on each project (40% of these from out of town locals), not to mention lower wages, change apprentice/journeyman ratios, cut benefits, double breast, etc., etc., etc. Of the 13 BAs in Ontario, 10 signed a "memorandum of agreement" that was to save us from the impositions of Bill 69. This agreement is worse than Bill 69. The one thing they definitely succeeded in doing was alienating IBEW from all the other trade unions that were standing in solidarity against the government.
The "memorandum of agreement" was put to the Ontario membership for a ratification vote as a package deal with a no strike clause. Prior to having knowledge of our amended local agreements, we were required to accept or reject a no strike clause with the memorandum of agreement. This was two issues, one vote, either accept both or reject both. They claim it was accepted. As of January 2001, all Ontario now has 50/50 hiring for both resident and non resident contractors. The BA for LU 303 then gave away even more in our local agreement.
I hope everyone can get a sense of how fast this came about for us in Ontario. The idea didn't originate here. There are other locals that have similar agreements throughout North America. Where was IO for all of this? Were they providing leadership? Have they approved any of these agreements? No, because these agreements are contrary to the IBEW Declaration, Objects and ideals. IO can't chock it up to LU autonomy with an IO approval stamp on it. If this is Brother Hill's definition of Local Union autonomy he should pick up a history book on the early 20th century. "He who forgets the past is destined to repeat it."
My web page has more info www.homestead.com/_nevergiveup .
FOR BROTHERHOOD !!!! Tim Mitchinson (IBEW LU 303)
From: "Tim Mitchinson" <tmitchinson@s...> Date: Sun May 20, 2001 2:57 pm Subject: Negotiated Agreements and IO Approval
"------" writes:
"In our contracts the IO approval is the same, it's a stamp the IO puts on the signature page and the signature page alone. I have yet to see a contract that repeats IO approval on other pages." When IO puts there stamp on the signature page they are approving the entire agreement.
"-----" then states: "Further, does the lack of IO approval negate a contract? The answer is NO! If a Local union enters into negotiations and the membership ratifies said agreement IO approval is a mute administrative point, the agreement is binding between the employer and the local. Remember what the Constitution states, the IO is not a party to this agreement." I agree with you -----, this is a moot point. Just because some of us adamantly oppose any such agreement and just because IO has sat in the bush on this issue, this does not mean that the agreement isn't binding on the signed parties. ----, I believe your on the right track when you state: "3)another reason for IO approval is for inclusion/exclusion of what I would term IO policy (I must admit that the IO policy I have seen appear for the most part to be crafted to protect a Local from running afoul of federal statue)." It appears IBEW policy conflicts with the IBEW Constitution.
For Brotherhood !!!! Tim Mitchinson (IBEW LU 303)
From: "Ed Hill" <EdwinHill@w...> Date: Sun May 20, 2001 11:31 pm Subject: Re: [ibew] IBEW becoming another Labor Ready? Say it ain't so!!
Brother Mitchinson: If you want you may print my answer to your question on this site. The problem is that there are members, yourself included, that want Local autonomy when it suites them and when the issue does not suit them they find it offensive. If the local unions want to run under the total control of the International Office that is fine, however I doubt that you would get many takers.
How a Local Union governs itself is certainly under the scrutiny of the International Office, but we are limited, by our constitution as to what we can do or want to do.
Your problem or complaint is at home and as I told you at the other site your officers did what they thought that they had to do and for the I still applaud them they are doing what they think is the best for the membership under the circumstances.
On your other issues of me traveling my own road, how do you expect an officer to have a discussion or make a comment on an issue if he/she is not permitted to have their own opinion and not necessarily agree with what is being said.
When I became an officer in this Great Brotherhood of ours I did not toss aside my right to voice an opinion on an issue. I hope that I can exercise the same rights, that I will defend for you, as long as it is not personal attack.
However I do have to voice an official opinion for which I am limited on an open forum, but I will continue to do so as much as possible. Ed Hill
From: "Tim Mitchinson" <tmitchinson@s...> Date: Mon May 21, 2001 6:30 am Subject: Opinions- everyone has one !
Brother Hill: It appears my relentless pursuit for accountability from your office is being misconstrued as a personal attack on you or that I am trying to deny you your rights to having and expressing an opinion. Your statement couldn't be further from the truth. I want you to express your opinion. I'm certain you realise my intentions are for no improper purpose when I express my opinion of your opinion. In other forums, this is called open debate. You state your facts and I state mine and then everyone can decide who is right, or more right for issues that are less than perfect.
I have been adamantly opposed to selective hiring far to long for you to accuse me of turning this into a personal issue. I am still, as I have always been, seeking clarification that "agreements" require the IP's approval pursuant to the Constitution and to know if IO condones selective hiring. I'm sure you can understand why IBEW members would like to know the International President's official position on these two items. I would think answering these questions would be one of the simplest of tasks for an International Officer, but then what do I know. I'm the one that thought this was a cut and dried case when I took it before the Ontario Labour Board. Under the current government I couldn't have been more wrong. Part of their decision to dismiss my case was based on IO's impartial attitude and failure to respond to the issue. The Board deemed that because IO hasn't expressed an opinion regarding selective hiring, IO must therefore be in favour of it. Will you continue to remain impartial and allow this agreement to spread throughout the rest of Canada and the USA?
You've stated, "If you want you may print my answer to your question on this site." I trust a simple www.ibewtravelers.net is sufficient.
You've stated, "The problem is that there are members, yourself included, that want Local autonomy when it suites them and when the issue does not suit them they find it offensive." I can't remember a time when I have ever been concerned over local autonomy, but if you say I have, OK. The one thing that I will always remember is turning down the first, and only referral where I was selected as a JW under this agreement. I doubt I will need to make that decision ever again, if you get my meaning. Perhaps I am not clear on what you consider local autonomy. Is it the one where locals decide their own destiny compared to other locals, or is local autonomy where locals decide how they are going to allow their own members to be screwed over by the contractors? It's ironic that you have also stated, "I hope that I can exercise the same rights, that I will defend for you". I admit I have quoted you out of context, but think about it.
You've stated, "On your other issues of me traveling my own road, how do you expect an officer to have a discussion or make a comment on an issue if he/she is not permitted to have their own opinion and not necessarily agree with what is being said." I believe I said you were not travelling your own road, but still going down Barry Ave., and for this I apologise if I have offended you. Since debate on this topic at the other site had evidently dried up before I had clarification of my queries, I made this statement to entice you into responding. The shear fact that you are once again openly debating these issues for all to see is commendable and I applaud you. Please continue.
You've stated, "Your problem or complaint is at home and as I told you at the other site your officers did what they thought that they had to do and for the I still applaud them they are doing what they think is the best for the membership under the circumstances." If you truly believe the leaders in Ontario have done what they've done for the good of the union, I can respect that. I would appreciate you respecting my opinion that I have based on the facts that I know. I can't accept that these decisions are in the best interests of our union. I admit, Bill 69 is bad news, but the Memorandum of Agreement is just as bad, in my opinion worse! A fallacious fear made the Memorandum of Agreement appear to be necessary to protect us from the additional threat made by the government to revoke section 1(4) of the Labour Act which would allow "double breasting". As I said before, sec 1(4) was amended and PASSED in such form that for all intents and purposes it should be considered revoked. The acceptance of the Memorandum of Agreement did not change anything. The government still PASSED Bill 69 with the amended Sec. 1(4). Like it or not, there is corroborating evidence that proves my claim.
You've stated, "However I do have to voice an official opinion for which I am limited on an open forum, but I will continue to do so as much as possible." Does this mean you still can't tell me if this agreement requires IP approval pursuant to the Constitution? Does this mean you can't tell me if IO approves of selective hiring for JWs?
You've stated, "If the local unions want to run under the total control of the International Office that is fine, however I doubt that you would get many takers." I don't believe I've ever asked for or suggested total control. Why do you suggest this now?
You've stated, "How a Local Union governs itself is certainly under the scrutiny of the International Office, but we are limited, by our constitution as to what we can do or want to do." Isn't this what I've been harping about. Scrutinise the issue and based on the IBEW Constitution, do what you can do, or are you already doing what you want to do?
FOR BROTHERHOOD !!! Tim Mitchinson (LU 303)
From: "Tim Mitchinson" <tmitchinson@s...> Date: Tue May 22, 2001 5:00 am Subject: Re: Opinions - everybody has one !
Brother Hill has been asked if he agrees with selective hiring. Although Brother Hill's response failed to answer the question, he asserts selective hiring is a local union issue. Brother Hill then points the finger at local union autonomy. Expectedly, all bearing on the real issue of selective hiring was then lost as brothers began to fear they might loose local union autonomy if this frame of questioning continues. Casting aside all consideration for brotherhood, they begin to rally behind Brother Hill. This is typical of what selective hiring agreements do. They divide Unions on every level through indirect means. When, for whatever reason, a member (or group of members) is willing to ignore that another member (or group of members) is being screwed over, a division is created. The Union's loss means additional gains for the contractors as new wage agreements then soon follow. Most will think selective hiring will never happen in their local. That's normal, here in Ontario, Canada, we also thought that. FOR BROTHERHOOD !!! Tim Mitchinson (LU 303)
From: "Tim Mitchinson" <tmitchinson@s...> Date: Tue May 22, 2001 4:24 pm Subject: Re: IBEW becoming another Labor Ready? Say it ain't so!!
Brother Hill:
I would like to print your posts and mine, which pertain to this topic on my web site www.homestead.com/_nevergiveup . Do I have your approval?
For Brotherhood !!! Tim Mitchinson
From: "Ed Hill" <EdwinHill@w...> Date: Tue May 22, 2001 7:56 pm Subject: Re: [ibew] Re: IBEW becoming another Labor Ready? Say it ain't so!!
Yes you do
Ed Hill
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